Author Topic: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?  (Read 823 times)

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Offline opium3

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Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« on: February 07, 2021, 05:30:10 PM »
Hi,

Are the discs/brakes any different between the Gen 3 Sport model compared to the SE-L models?

thanks, Steve.

Offline Engineer Andy

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2021, 04:02:31 PM »
Hi,

Are the discs/brakes any different between the Gen 3 Sport model compared to the SE-L models?

thanks, Steve.

Good question, as I'd like to know the same for the gen-4 models as well.  Admitedly with the latter, the 'Sport' trim model is now a lower spec than it used to be with the addition of the Sport Tech and GT Sport versions, which come shod on 18in rims and I've seen 'Sport' (only) coming on 16in rims.  I'd like to know whether wheel downsizing on those top spec cars is possible, as they all can come on the higher output 2.0 SA-X engine platform.

If I recall correctly, the gen-1 cars could only accept 16in wheels and larger for the 2.0 Sport, not sure about the 1.6 Sport though.  My 1.6 TS2 is able to accept 15in, 16in and 17in rims according to the handbook.  Some of those restrictions must've been due to larger brakes being used on upper trim/engine models.

I personally don't see the point in having larger brakes on upper trim cars when, even with the SA-X engine they aren't REALLY quick.  For a 2.5T petrol, definitely, but it doesn't look like we're getting that variant here any time soon.

Offline opium3

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2021, 08:59:00 PM »
Cheers Andy.

I did ask the question as I am downsizing from the Sport Nav 18" OEM wheels to some of the 62 design 16" OEM wheels - at the grand sum of £309 for a set which seemed really cheap for any set of OEM wheels.

I have not seen the 62 design 16" on any Maz3 so I am eager to see them fitted - this week!

I am hoping for a much better ride - especially over speed bumps & potholes, lower road noise and higher mileage from a set of tyres.

Also, the 205/16/60 Goodyear tyres were far cheaper than 18" ones - another reason for downsizing.

Offline Engineer Andy

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2021, 10:43:14 AM »
Cheers Andy.

I did ask the question as I am downsizing from the Sport Nav 18" OEM wheels to some of the 62 design 16" OEM wheels - at the grand sum of £309 for a set which seemed really cheap for any set of OEM wheels.

I have not seen the 62 design 16" on any Maz3 so I am eager to see them fitted - this week!

I am hoping for a much better ride - especially over speed bumps & potholes, lower road noise and higher mileage from a set of tyres.

Also, the 205/16/60 Goodyear tyres were far cheaper than 18" ones - another reason for downsizing.

The 18in tyres are expensive, though not quite as much as they used to be, coming in (looking at BlackCircles) at between £95 - £130 each, plus fitting.

That's exactly the reason why I downsized mine from 16in OEMs to 15in: at least one of my car's OEM wheels was corroding enough to allow air to escape from the tyre (the wheels were 12-13 years old at the time) and my tyres were near to replacement anyway, so I decided to change both at the same time.  For some reason, the cost of each OEM 16in tyre for the gen-1 car was a whopping £156 compared to £85 for the 15in equivalent.  16in rims for the gen-3 and 4 cars appear to be, as you say, even cheaper.

Additionally, changing from 205/55 R16V tyres to 195/65 R15H (V also acceptable according to the handbook) save me between £10 (summer tyres) and £25 (all-seasons) a tyre.  I worked it out that it would cost me only a bit more to replace (and downsize) all 4 wheels and tyres than just to replace one 16in wheel and all 4 tyres on a like-for-like basis using all-season tyres.  Given the alloys were all corroding, I thought it best to go with the downsizing option, and even changing down one size has improved the ride quality on my car.

It also means that the tyres are less susceptible to blow-outs due to the alloys getting damaged from potholes and kerbs, plus repairs/replacements of allows due to scuffing.  The slightly narrower tyres give better mpg (on a like-for-like basis), are more quiet and work better in winter conditions, as I was able to afford good quality all season tyres (CrossClimate+).  They should also last longer, saving more money on replacements or repairs.  A win-win.

I had a look on my local dealership's website yesterday and saw a gen-4 GT Sport SA-X, and noticed that the brakes were quite small in comparison to the standard 18in rims, so it's highly likely that all current gen-3 and 4 cars can have their 18in OEM wheels downsized to 16in (not 15in).  It's still a shame that they changed the size of the standard 16in tyre from 205/55 R16 to 205/60, as it means that they cost in the region of about £85 - £110 each (plus fitting) for top makes compared to £50 - £75 for the 205/55 R16 (top end for all-seasons).  My 15inCC+s cost me about £51 plus fitting.

I haven't noticed any difference in handling on my car, probably because the improvement from one tyre generation (or two) has offset the 10mm decrease in tyre width and 14mm extra sidewall height.

Offline opium3

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2021, 07:27:11 PM »
So I did a test drive with the new 16" wheels and Goodyear Efficient Grip Performance 2 tyres.

I did a half hours drive on poor urban roads and a dual carriageway. The differences were immediate and obvious. I drove quickly but by no means fast. There was a small reduction in front 'bite' and turn in was slightly less direct, the ride was much improved and there was clearly less road noise.

The benefits are large and well worth having and when you also factor in cheaper and longer lasting tyres it is a no brainer I think.

Offline StevenRB45

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2021, 08:44:38 PM »
I'd imagine you also have a much wider choice of tyres as well.

Seem to recall you can't get any all-seasons to fit the 18 only full sports tyres or winter unless things have changed.

Whereas 205/60 16 appears to have a full range of choices.

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2021, 08:03:15 PM »
I'd imagine you also have a much wider choice of tyres as well.

Seem to recall you can't get any all-seasons to fit the 18 only full sports tyres or winter unless things have changed.

Whereas 205/60 16 appears to have a full range of choices.

Indeed.  The ratio of tyres available overall is around 10:3:1 for 205/55R16 to 205/60R16 to 215/45R18, plus the latter is often not available in the latest tyres - often you have to choose previous generation tyres that are relatively poor or average at best on the rolling resistance and wear front, plus no all season option.  That plus the huge difference in price.  The 205/60R16 is slowly growing in popularity, but its still nothing compared to the 55 profile version, one of the three most popular tyre sizes.

In my view, the small reduction in grip/handling ability is far outweighed by the far better ride comfort, resistance to damage (tyres and wheels), lower wear rates and running costs (including the price of the tyres).  And that's not even factoring in getting decent all season tyres and still having a big chunk of change compared to 18in summer tyres, which means you still get decent summer performance but tyres that work in snowy/icy conditions.

I could understand staying with 18in wheels and tyres for an 'MPS' type car, but both the gen-3 Sport 165 and gen-4 SA-X are not hot hatches, and probably why the latter now has a no-cost option when buying new to select 16in wheels and tyres on at least some of the 2.0 SA-X models (not sure about the GT Sport versions though [bigger brakes perhaps?], but they are available on the standard 'Sport').
« Last Edit: March 17, 2021, 08:06:39 PM by Engineer Andy »

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Re: Gen 3 Sport Nav - are the brakes any different?
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2021, 08:03:15 PM »